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Let's say it takes 5 minutes for the little "star" I observe at night to cross the sky from horizon to horizon. If one assumes a circular orbit and that the object in question is indeed in orbit around this planet; is it then possible to guesstimate orbital height?

How would the calculations be done?

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    $\begingroup$The simple case where the satellite passes right overhead can be solved by drawing two circles and two triangles and applying some trigonometry. But if it doesn't pass straight overhead, if the maximum elevation angle is less than 90 degrees, then I think you need spherical trigonometry. The practical problem is that the satellite becomes invisible before it reaches the horizon due to the atmosphere, and of course it's challenging for a low orbiting (therefore bright) satellite to remain sunlit (out of Earth's shadow) for the entire time.$\endgroup$
    – uhoh
    CommentedApr 12 at 22:56

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Answer: Orbital altitude above the observer can be estimated from a satellite's apparent angular velocity.

The time it takes a satellite to cross the sky is very difficult to estimate with any accuracy, so I suggest you make your observation at the zenith instead.

The complete horizon is seldom visible, except at sea . The moment you first notice a satellite will seldom be the moment it appears at the horizon since you have no warning, so the “start” time will likely be inaccurate.

And, unlike on the Moon, the view of objects at the Earth's horizon are displaced and obscured. For instance, the sun is displaced an entire solar diameter when it is on the horizon. This is why low altitude sightings are not used in celestial navigation.

I suggest you rely on observing transits when the satellite is as high as possible, preferably within 30 degrees of the zenith.

The method described below will give a 2 significant figure estimate of a satellite’s orbital altitude (above the observer, not as measured from the center of the Earth). Its ease of use relies on some obviously simplistic assumptions:

Assumption: Satellite orbits, and the Earth, are flat. This is a reasonable assumption since the satellite altitude is an order of magnitude less than the earth’s radius.

Assumption: All observable satellites have the same speed. This is not true, but within tolerance for our purposes. The ISS speed is 7.66km/sec at 400km while Iridium satellites orbit with a speed of 7.45km/sec at an altitude of 780km. These examples cover the range of most visible satellites, so we can average it at 7.6km/sec.

Our observation datum is the time a satellite takes to cross the field of your binoculars. The field width is stamped on the binocular chassis, usually about 7.5 degrees. Since all LEO satellites travel at the same speed (for our purposes), the distance covered is proportional to the time taken to cross the field. The distance from the observer is a fixed multiple (1/sin7.5) of this distance.

To fine tune the result, correction can be made for Zenith angle (angle between the zenith and satellite at the time of observation). If the zenith has been previously identified (say, with a plumb bob or spirit level), the zenith angle can be estimated by the number of hand spans between satellite and zenith.

enter image description here

In practice, the observation is easiest from a supine position. Orient your feet towards the West since most satellites will be approaching from that quadrant. They will disappear as they reach the earth’s umbra before they get to the Eastern horizon. Have your assistant zero their stopwatch.

enter image description here

Pick a satellite which you judge will pass within 30 degrees of your zenith. Capture it in the field of view and follow it towards the zenith. Position the satellite against the trailing edge of the field of view and track it in that position. When the satellite is overhead, stop moving the binoculars to freeze the starfield in your view. Say “mark” so your assistant can start the stopwatch. When the satellite reaches the other edge of the field of view, say “mark” again to capture the transit time “t”. Say it is 8.5 sec in our example

The orbital distance “d” covered is

d=8.5sec(7.6km/sec)=64.6km.

Distance from the observer is

64.6/sin7.5=495km.

If the satellite passes off the zenith, a cosine correction can be applied using an estimated zenith angle. In our case, a zenith angle of 20* corrects the altitude to 465km

enter image description here

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  • $\begingroup$But if we use the orbital speed and height to compute the angular speed in degrees per second of the ISS and an Iridium satellite the results are very different: 1.09 to 0.54 °/sec. The differences of the orbital speed are small but the heights are very different. arcsin(7.66 / 400) = 1.09$\endgroup$
    – Uwe
    CommentedApr 14 at 16:44
  • $\begingroup$@Uwe ... Yes. The angular speeds are very different. That is what is being measured. Then ANGULAR speed is used, along with assumed ORBITAL speed, to calculate the altitudes.$\endgroup$
    – Woody
    CommentedApr 14 at 20:16
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    $\begingroup$Assuming all satellites orbit at the same speed is the same as assuming they are all at the same altitude. (Due to Kepler's $ p^2=ka^3 $ law ), so there is no math to do.$\endgroup$CommentedApr 14 at 21:22
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    $\begingroup$@GregMiller satellites at say 400 and 800 km have almost the same orbital velocity (less than 3% difference), but one is twice as close to the observer than the other, so the apparent angular velocity is double. It's a "guestimation" method - exactly what the question asks for. For satellites much farther away when the orbital velocity drops significantly, they're not likely to be visible anyway, at least by eye. But for the binocular-based method one does have to be a little more careful because the visibility selection is not as strong.$\endgroup$
    – uhoh
    CommentedApr 14 at 23:13
  • $\begingroup$@GregMiller ... Kepler's law provides the distance from the system's barycenter, not the altitude above the body's surface. If the measurement was taken from the center of the Earth. Kepler's laws would apply.$\endgroup$
    – Woody
    CommentedApr 17 at 5:22
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Consider this a supplementary answer for the sake of those readers who would opt for a bit more accuracy at the price of more work than a "guestimate".

Approximate orbital determination is frequently by Gauss's method, which is one of the earliest methods. This technique uses three positions and times of those observations. The positions have to be translated into radii from Earth's center with a little work. However, their accuracy is better is they are nearly overhead, instead of horizon to horizon because of parallax errors. See the Wikipedia article,

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gauss%27s_method 

It's simple enough one can make reasonable estimates using a calculator or spreadsheet. I'm sure if you look around, there is a canned method for reducing observations taken from a single location (latitude, longitude, time). Knowing the correct Universal Time (Zulu or GMT) is essential but this can be had from the exact local time and longitude. More accurate results are obtained from additional observations collected at other times and/or places.

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  • $\begingroup$@uhoh The method is far too involved to be reproduced here. Almost any textbook on celestial mechanics would be a good source. The answer should probably state that.$\endgroup$CommentedApr 14 at 12:03
  • $\begingroup$@GregMiller OK I've added a preamble.$\endgroup$
    – uhoh
    CommentedApr 14 at 13:21
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Here's my own formula to make calculations of overhead pass time and orbital height:

$$t = \arccos \left(\frac{r}{r+x}\right) \frac{1}{\pi}\sqrt{k(r+x)^3}$$

where

  • t is time (in seconds) it takes to pass from horizon to horizon

  • r is Earth's (equatorial) radius (6378137) in meters

  • x is orbital height above Earth's surface, in meters

  • k = $4 \pi^2/(GM) \approx 9.90425 \times 10^{-14}$ where $GM$ is Earth's standard gravitational parameter

Trig and Kepler's third law did the trick! ChatGPT made the graph below. Thanks for all replies, BTW!

The formula seems to get me the correct answers.

f(x)=my formula; x in million meters, the dependent variable in seconds

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    $\begingroup$+1 for putting all together. The graph might be more user-friendly if the vertical axis were labeled as Time (seconds) (or better yet, minutes) instead of f(x) and if the horizontal axis were Satellite Altitude (km) instead of x (meters *1e6).$\endgroup$
    – JohnHoltz
    CommentedApr 16 at 22:00
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    $\begingroup$at a bare minimum, if you look at the function over an extended domain (e.g. at x up to 36,000,000, geosynchronous altitude) the function you present returns an incorrect horizon to horizon time (which should be infinite for those satellites).$\endgroup$
    – Erin Anne
    CommentedApr 16 at 22:04
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    $\begingroup$@ErinAnne makes a good point - the Earth is rotating too. You might be able to make an approximate correction by subtracting Earth's equatorial velocity 2 $ \pi$ 6378137 (m) / 86164 (s) where those are Earth's radius and sidereal rotation periods. OR you could just plot from 200 to 1000 km only, which would be a more relevant range for eye-visible satellites.$\endgroup$
    – uhoh
    CommentedApr 16 at 23:28
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    $\begingroup$btw I've rewritten your equations using MathJax notation which is standard here.$\endgroup$
    – uhoh
    CommentedApr 16 at 23:45
  • $\begingroup$Erin Anne has a point, of course! Our planet rotates. I'll try to figure out the formula that takes that into account. If somebody doesn't beat me to it...$\endgroup$CommentedApr 17 at 22:05

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